Tags to Separate Skate vs Classic Nordic Skiing

Designate a separate activity tag for Classic skiing versus Skate skiing. 

 

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159 comments
  • I agree that separation of classic and skate is appropriate.  It's much like road biking and unicycling:)  The best approach would be to have 4 activities: Cross-Country Skiing: Skate, Cross-Country Skiing: Classic, Rollerskiing: Skate, Rollerskiing: Classic.  

    I would concede that if that is too much work, the skiing community would be plenty happy just having the Nordic/Cross Country jazz all cleaned up into one singular "Cross Country Skiing" activity, along with a secondary summer activity "Rollerskiing".  

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  • Yes please, split classic and skate skiing. And let us set them on the app where we can now choose biking of running. Thanks! Winter ski season is in full swing. Love this app.
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  • As some has mentioned, this should be the same for the summer activity "Roller ski" obv.

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  • Hi folks! We're hoping to clear up the confusion between the Nordic Skiing and Cross Country Skiing activity types, as these two separate types are duplicates (this would not be related to the original topic of separating the activity into skate and classic skiing).

    The proposed solution would be to keep "Nordic Skiing" activity type and remove "Cross Country Skiing", while migrating all existing Cross Country activities to the Nordic activity type. 

    Is there any feedback from this thread as to the preferred solution? 

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  • Nordic is the most common name for it here in Anchoage, by far. It's the Nordic Ski Association, the popular kids program is Junior Nordic, We call them Nordic ski trails.... And it's a much shorter word to display on the drop-down list in the iphone app.
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  • Elle...great to see some movement on this topic. There are actually 2 aspects of this thread...and the aspect you've suggested that needs to be changed is a bit of a drift from Rosi's original request. Let me see if I can clarify it here:

    1. Nordic vs. Cross Country: Yes, these are the same, and should be combined. Nordic is more traditional and the more accepted term these days in Nordic ski circles and Nordic ski areas across the United States and the world. You can google the term "Nordic" for just about any ski area, and nearly all of them have a place officially called a "Nordic Center" of some sort. Cross country on the other hand is an old school term used primarily in the United States, and is a term usually used by those folks that don't typically Nordic ski.

    2. Rosi first started this thread, and suggested that Nordic be SPLIT into SKATE and CLASSIC, and I and other Strava users suggested also sugggested adding ROLLER SKI as sub categories to NORDIC. One can think of these sub categories like STREET RUNNING, TRAIL RUNNING, and SPEED WALKING. Or, think of it as STREET RIDING and MOUNTAIN BIKING. While SKATE, CLASSIC, and ROLLER SKI look the same to the casual observer, SKATE, CLASSIC, and ROLLER skiers use different gear, ski on different prepared terrain, and require a WIDELY different skill set for each of skiing. Go to youtube to confirm this if needed. Also, many NORDIC skiers are into training with heart-rate monitors, and I'm sure many of them will tell you that each style of skiing will produce different maximum heart-rates and muscle fatigue. 

    In the Pacific Northwest, there are many Strava RUNNERS who I follow who are skiing today. Some are CLASSIC skiing, some are SKATE skiing (that's me!), and in the off season...at home, many of us are ROLLER SKIING on urban trails to stay in shape for our winter love of NORDIC skiing.

    I think everyone here would agree with me on these points. Combining NORDIC and CROSS COUNTRY is a great first move. Creating CLASSIC, SKATE, and ROLLER SKIING would also provide serious athletes a way to track their mileage like they do on their street and mountain bikes.

    Thank you for paying attention to this thread. Have a great 2015 and Happy New Year!

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  • Thanks Elle, good to see it's finally moving in the right direction.  Living above the 49th parallel and near to the Rocky Mountains, 99% of the "segments" are under the Nordic title so it would be nice to see it continue for the foreseeable future while "cross country" is merged into it.  I'm ambivalent about the splitting into skate/classic. I do them both, lots, and I just label them in the title or description.  However, bringing Nordic into the core of Strava's segment display would be a blessing.   

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  • As a follow up to my earlier post...

    Separating SKATE and CLASSIC is important for any serious Strava athlete, since they compete virtually on the same courses/routes/trails. It's likely most SKATE skiers are faster on some trails than CLASSIC skiers, and visa-versa on other trails. Knowing this, KOM's and CR's are skewed towards the faster style, whatever that might be...so chasing after a CR is virtually meaningless for any NORDIC skier...since the style isn't defined in Strava.

    In the Olympics, the style is defined for the event, either classic or free (skate), so it only makes sense to separate these in Strava. Here's from Olympic.org:

    • The skating - or free - technique, which was developed in the 1970s, closely resembles the motions of ice skating, where one pushes the inside edge of the ski simultaneously backward and outward at about a 45-degree angle. It usually is faster than classic technique.
    • Classic technique: The traditional ski racing technique. Athletes use a diagonal stride in which both skis stay parallel to each other.


    I should note that even olympic.org still uses "Cross Country" vs. Nordic. Hopefully pointing this out here doesn't confuse things too much. I imagine there will be an eventual shift in the USA Olympic committee's language, too. IMHO, using the term "Nordic" provides due respect to the origins of the sport. 

    I've shared more than my 2 cents worth...others?

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  • For what it's worth, I don't think it's a huge deal whether it's called Nordic or Cross Country.  The most important thing is consolidating them into 1 category to clean up the Cross Country/Nordic confusion...and THEN breaking it apart into Nordic Skiing - Skate, and Nordic Skiing - Classic.  The 2 styles are so vastly different that they do deserve a different activity type.  It's akin to freestyle swimming vs breaststroke---you would never measure pool records agnostic of the technique.  

    The sooner the merge can happen the better, as I notice new segments being created daily on 'Cross Country Skiing' despite all the old/similar ones laying dormant under Nordic Skiing. 

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  • Thanks for the excellent feedback. Stay tuned for the Nordic/Cross Country activity type confusion to be resolved early in 2015. Until then, keep the comments coming!

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  • Awesome, sounds like some changes coming. Elle, thanks for taking action!

    My request is that you add heart rate data, points in the red, HR zones, calories burned - all the things running and biking have in regards to training and fitness - seems like it would easy to do.

    I'm excited to see the new changes- thank you!

     

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  • For German Strava users it is very confusing at the moment: There are two activity types displayed "Skilanglauf" (I guess this is used for the English "Cross country skiing") and "Skilanglaufen" (used for the English "Nordic Skiing").  The words "Skilanglauf" and "Skilanglaufen" mean besides some grammatical difference more or less the same.

    Please keep the acticity types "Nordic Skiing" and the german translation "Skilanglaufen".

    Would be great having this issue fixed soon, as we have currently optimal conditions for nordic skiing.

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  • I transferred from Garmin Connect earlier. Now I see that Garmin Connect have separate activities for classicXC skiing and skateXC skiing. With the mess between Nordic and now cross-country skiing I am considering reverting back.

    My suggestions for 4 activities:

    Rollerski (tick)

    Skate rollerski (tick)

    Cross-country skiing (sort of tick, except all my activities are now sorted under Nordic)

    Skate skiing

     

    Furthermore, I may run and bike, but my main Activity is skiing. What I would like to see is skiing as a default Activity since it looks as though I don't Train in the Winter or when I rollerski in the Summer.

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  • 4 types of activities needed, and I doubt anyone disagrees:

    • Cross Country / Nordic Skiing - Classic
    • Cross Country / Nordic Skiing - Skate / Free style
    • Roller Skiing - Classic
    • Roller Skiing - Skate / Free style

    If you are doing classic style you can not compete with the people doing skate.
    When changing all old activities they should all be turned to "Skate" since that is the fastest of the two techniques. Otherwise it will be impossible to beat some segments. An easy way to go through all old activities and updating them to correct activity type would also be help full. Finding old activities and changing them is difficult and time consuming atm, to say the least....

     

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  • nice to see that Nordic skiing and cross-country skiing will be merged into one activity  since they basically are the same and I see lots of confusion. I also hope there will be separate activities for Skate and classic skiing, I do both and would like to track my efforts separately

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  • And overall it would be great if there are the cross-country skiing classic and skating as well as roller skiing classic and skating kilometers (and the elevation gain) totalized like they are in running and cycling!!!

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  • Same here - As most others, I'd love to see 4 activities (Ski / Roller + Classic / Skating) - sharing all segments created in any of the for activities, but creating different rankings for each.

    Especially important: That all segments (and leaderboards) previously created under Nordic Skiing are being taken over into Cross-country Skating, merged with the current Cross-country skiing. And the current Roller-Skiing activity should be renamed into Roller-Skiing Skating.

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  • Currently speed is shown as km/hour for Cross-Country Skiing and min/km for Nordic Skiing and. Personally I prefer the latter, but even better is to have both listed.

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  • Common Strava! Separate skate and classic.  Make them both available on the App. Is this really that hard?  I feel like you are not listening to your users?

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  • As many other already mentioned on this page: there shouldn't be a big problem to deal with cross-country-skiing like running or cycling - please strava, do this for your big cross-country-skiing community. We all appreciated to have the options "suffer score", total km, total elevation gain etc. in crosscountry-skiing (skating/classic) and roller skiing (skating/classic) as well. Many thanks.

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  • I can say, that unfortunately missing SKATE and CLASSIC cross country selection is very confusing here. I vote for adding these two technique of skiing separately in order to select, whether I run this or that way. The reason was said (let us do not consider snow conditions of course) - there are different results on the same track using these two techniques for every single skier (try yourself :))

    I Hope STAVA.COM team will add it as soon as possible.

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  • Hi,

    The bottom line is this. Classic and Skate Skiing are different sports. It is NOT just something that could be solved with specifying the equipment. Currently the leaderboards and segments are meaningless for classic cross-country/nordic skiing. It is like having one combined leaderboard for running and cycling. Totally useless. i.e. The main reason for using Strava has been nullified.

    That said, around here it is called cross country skiing. Hardly anyone here uses the term Nordic skiing. The International Ski Federation also calls it cross country, not Nordic. see: http://www.fis-ski.com/cross-country/ Also, Endomondo, Runkeeper use the term cross country skiing. Having it be called Nordic skiing on Strava would be needlessly confusing.

    I think that first, "Nordic skiing" and "Cross-country skiing" activity types should be merged into "Free Technique Cross Country Skiing". Second, a "Classic Technique Cross Country Skiing" activity type should be added. You could abbreviate these down to "Skate Ski" and "Classic Ski" or "FT XC Ski" and "CT XC Ski" or "XC Skate Ski" and "XC Classic Ski" or whatever most people can agree on.

    Also, it should be possible for people to go back and (bulk) change their existing activities to the appropriate activity type. This way, if someone (like me) has done predominantly classic skiing, then they can easily change most of may skiing activities to the appropriate type.

    PS. being able to choose something other than running or biking from the iPhone App would really help out as well.

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  • This topic is now thoroughly discussed, so why don't Strava do anything With it ?

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  • I second most of these opinions. Please, finally clean up the nordic/cross country skiing mess and when on that, make cross country skiing a category 1 sport on the same level as cycling and running (with annual stats etc.). Come on, it can't be that hard! However, I don't agree with the voices calling for separating classic and skate skiing completely. Those are both cross country skiing activities. Similar to road and mountain biking or, even more closely, freestyle and breaststroke in swimming.

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  • Any update yet? The winter has passed soon and still we dont have:

    • Cross Country / Nordic Skiing - Classic
    • Cross Country / Nordic Skiing - Skate / Free style
    • Roller Skiing - Classic
    • Roller Skiing - Skate / Free style

    And again, once you created this make sure every old activity is registered as skate since otherwise we will have impossible segment records to beat in Classic style...

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  • 1. Nordic skies and cross country skiing must be combined! ASAP!

    2. Classic and skate should be split into two activities!

    3. It should be possible to search for segments for other activities then running and cycling.

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  • 1) Nordic skiing classic

    2) Nordic skiing skate

    3) Roller skiing classic

    4) Roller skiing skate

     

    !!!

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  • It's about time that this mess was cleared up. Who's big idea was it to move all cross country skiing activities over to something called Nordic? Now half of the community registers there activities under Nordic and the other half under CrossCountry skiing.
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  • engelski: Well, it was the other way around - Nordic ski har been there for a long time, while cross-country skiing showed up last fall and has made a mess.

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  • I would also suggest ditching the term "nordic skiing" entirely.  In English, it covers too broad a spectrum of sports to be meaningful, while in French "ski nordique" (which is what the app/website translates it as) is conventionally used to refer only to backcountry skiing.

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