Segment Leaderboards

This is the post for all feedback and feature requests related to Segment Leaderboards.

 

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297 commenti
  • Linus Holmgren Totally agree with you. I help out at the local MTB-park and the trails are constantly evolving, this must be problem for many parks. The leaderboards for the recent routes are completely irrelevant since it's all runs made a year ago on a much shorter/faster route, sad because it makes the concept of segments useless in the park.

    The simple solution would be an option to not include previous runs when creating a segment. A box to tick if you don't want to include runs retroactively.

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  • Don MacDonald - E-bikes are already separated out, so that is not part of this discussion.  If you see those rides showing up in the leaderboards, they should be flagged.  As far as seasonal leaderboards, how would you choose when to separate them?  Snow comes and goes at different times every year in any one location, much less across the country/world.  It would be impossible to pick a date range for any season that would be remotely accurate across multiple years.  Here in Alaska, we have some years where we have little to no snow even through the end of December and people are rallying the trails on mountain bikes.  Other years, we have snow early in the fall and/or late in the spring, so people on fat bikes are still hammering the segments when it would traditionally be mountain bike season.  Personally, I like the idea that some segments are faster in the summer and some are faster in the winter.  We don't need there to be multiple sets of leaderboards for every segment.  That just starts leaning towards the "everyone gets a medal" idea which is a bit annoying.  

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  • I recently rode on a tarmac road next to a off road segment. I was recorded as doing the segment and awarded 2 x KOM. I am unable to delete the KOMs without changing the ride to private. I don't wish to do that, but I do want to take out the false KOMs. There should be a way to do this, after all it's my ride and i should be able to delete my recorded effort if it's incorrect.

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  • Jason Lamoreaux I would think maybe a button you could click that says snow vs dirt maybe. Anything would be nice instead of having the top 50 riders being riders in the snow on our local trails.

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  • Sounds like what a lot of people want could be addressed by a more flexible set of filters on the leaderboards.

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  • I think the should include more ebike activities.
    Yes it sucks to get old. But since I bought my ebike I am able to ride further and longer. We seam to be discriminated because we ride an ebike. I've had mine for 6 weeks and have ridden more than I ever had. And it's a great feeling. My wife and son both have them and we now ride together as a family again. Just because we have a little assistance doesn't mean we are not getting a workout. We should be able to enjoy the Strava accomplishments like anyone else. Never in my life would the words "I'm going to ride my bike to work" ever come out of my mouth. Now I ride 2-3 times a week. Strave needs to start bring us into the community. Ebikes are at record sales. The bike shops can't keep them on the floor.
    Start including us,

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  • Be great to have a filter to include or exclude pro athletes from leader boards so you can see how you stack up against other mere mortals!

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  • Please add a “Rowing/Kayak Crew member” feature to select or filter crew members on rowing/kayak activities in segments / and also for “Personal best”.

    Today it’s all mixed - hard to know your personal best in a 1x racing shell if you also added 2x , 4x Session in rowing/kayak activity.

    And hard to compare youre time to others when it’s all mixed.

    ** Still supercool to mix kayak and rowers in same segments as long as crew members are the same.

    I think a kayak/rowing Activities should have a required field to add crew members - then Segments can be displayed in all possible combinations - still also superfun to compare a 1x against a 4x.

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  • There's too much on this forum to read but I just wanted to request that on the strava app that it includes the 'I'm following' leaderboard. It's the leaderboard I look at the most on the Web as they are real people. I couldn't care less for the order leaderboards.

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  • Solo V Group Rides

    The only value I get from the subscription is challenging myself and people in my age group on segments. It's motivating to see the progression and how I rate amongst that group. However, very few KOM's are held by individual riders and yet, in my view, it would very easy for Strava identify group rides and seperate them out from solo efforts. I'm surprised that more people are not raising this? 

    I once found myself in the top 10 of a segment in London with over 20,000 users on it and was determined to improve that. Then a male and female crit race was held on closed roads in the city and that segment was on the course.....I then found myself pushed down to around 30 or 40 thus destroying any motivation I had to try and claim that solo KOM. Not going to happen against a group let alone Pro's.

    Come on Strava....you know it makes sense.

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  • Running segments: the new/improved mobile maps/segments "feature" needs some serious improvement. I live near a small forest with a main track and a number of side / interconnecting tracks. there are segments in both directions on every track, sometimes multiples. the main one would be used multiple times every day, dozens on the weekend, sometimes by groups of 10-30 runners at a time. the segments have been there for a few years now, so there would be perhaps 1000 or more runs recorded per year on some.

    all this makes me wonder why premium account cannot "discover" any of these segments - not a single one - not even the ones where i'm on the leader board or am the local legend. there's a big blank spot on the map, an area surrounded by discoverable segments. others on free accounts can see perhaps 3 segments, and sometimes one or none when they zoom into places where there are only a handful of segments.

    why can't segments that are used less than those in the off screen surroundings be seen on the map? what's the point of keeping them secret?

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  • SKIP TO THE BOTTOM FOR VOTE EXPLAINATION

    I want a change to the policy of strava. Currently the policy on strava excludes velomobiles, faired bikes, and bikes with aero dynamics whuch most modern bukes are coming designed with aerodynamics in mind, non "conventional" bikes to include hand cycles, recumebent trikes, etc which are often used by those with disibilities who cant ride a upright bike anymore from acheivements, leaderboards, segments, public view, and doesnt count towards distance per month cycled, doesnt count towards anything bike related. I would like to see it changed to include the above on leaderboards, events, distance cycled per month. This is important to me because i have a velomobile and a recumbent trike and would like to be entitled to all the same as road bikes, tt bikes, racers, etc that are allowed to ride in a group and get koms, acheivements, and earn their distance challenges and be visible to the public without discrimination and making it impossible for solo riders to compete for koms. My solution is to either make the policy inclusive or you have to apply the same policy to groups of riders a group being more than 1 rider as even 2 riders can create a significant aero dynamic advantage, riders on tt bikes as they are aerodynamically designed to give advantages a "conventional" bikes doesnt have, riders on aero frame or aero designed bikes to include bikes with carbon disc wheels, any event marked race shall be excluded from strava segments and acheivements as they are not earned without assistance from pack cars, other riders, and gear not available to the public. Changing the policy to allow non conventional bikes, faired bikes, recumbents, hand cycles, and such will allow disabled riders, velomobiles, and bikes with aerodynamic design (which most modern bikes already do have) to compete in leaderboards, segments, strava events, and be vireable to the public. That is important to me because in my opinion a bike is a bike as long as its not assisted by a motor electric or otherwise and i heavily rely on strava to see how fast i am against other cyclists that have done the same route since i dont ride with anybody idk how fast i am against other cyclists and so this is the only way i can compete with other cyclists. Its also important for disabled riders have the ability to be included in leaderboards and shouldnt be discriminated against just because they ride a recumbent or faired recumbent bike i think that is morally wrong. You are pretyy much saying keep your disabled but off our leaderboards and you dont matter in fact we wont even recognize you as a cyclist even though you were a cyclist on a regular bike before you got injured and using a recumebent cycle is the only way you can ride anymore or even for those cyclists who chose a recumbent bike for comfort. Its important you allow these different as you call them "non conventional" bikes on leaderboards so that we can compete against other cyclists and be able to post our activities publically without getting banned. If you chose to go with the other option to be more restrictive you would have to exclude group rides, rides on tt bikes, aero road bikes, aero gravel bikes, anything with aero styled wheels, bars, helmets, clothing, and tail attachments that reduce air drag. This is important to note because on a solo road bicycle without aerodynamic designs makes it impossible to compete with cyclists who ride in a group (more than 1), tt bikes which are by design, designed to be aero and therefore cant be caught by regular solo or even a group of cyclists. To also be included in the restriction should be aero dynamically designed bikes ie. The new 2020 Cannondale systemsix to include bikes with any sort of aero wheels, bars, aero clothing, helmets, tails that make them more streamlined, etc. Imo this should even out the playing field but would very hard to identify and new rules would need to be established defining what a "conventional" bike is as conventional by definition is what is generally and varies based on location,and groups your associated with (ie. A velonaut that rides with other velomobiles often could determine a velomobile is a conventional bike, a velodrome rider could determine their bike is a conventional bike based on their surroundings, a solo cyclist can determine their bike is a conventional bike because its the only thing they ride) its really left up to interpretation without definition. If the policy is left in tact you will be losing more and more cyclists that realize the potential of faired bikes, recumbent trikes (adaptive bikes), hand cycles (adaptive bikes), etc.

    FOR THE VOTE

    YES to change the policy to include velomobiles(faired recumbent), recumebent trikes, handcycles, recumbent bikes, and other non assisted cycles to the public view, leaderboards, distance challenges, acheivements, and strava competitions.

    NO to make the policy more restrictive to restrict the above and add aerodynamically designed bikes to include any form of aero wheel, aero clothing, aero helmets, aero bars, aero frame design, aero attachments such as tail bags, tails, even an ultra light rider that is below normal healthy weight. As well as add any form of tt bike. As well as add any group ride (more than 1 rider) to the restrictions. As well as add ultralight bicycles under 14.99lbs as defined by uci regulation. These bikes shal not be allowed in public view, not allowed on leaderboards, or public strava events.

    DONT VOTE to keep the policy in tact and not change a thing.

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  • Tony Poole - How would Strava be able to know if a ride was part of a "group" ride where drafting potentially impacted the speeds?  So far, they have not been very successful when trying to identify when a person rode with another person.  I get listed on my activities as having run or ridden with so and so all the time when it is rarely accurate.  Many times, I never even see the person I supposedly rode with, I just happen to be following a similar route around the same time.  Heck, even in races when there others around, there is no way to identify if my effort was assisted by others.  In a time trial or a hill climb, I could be riding within 10-20 seconds of others, but never get any benefit of any draft, yet it would claim I was riding with others and would remove me from eligibility for segment leaderboards even though my effort was a solo, unassisted effort.  

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  • Ah, the weekly "I want my wheeled contraption on the leaderboard" post. Let's create a leaderboard for unicycles, tricycles, hand cycles, recumbents, tandems, single speeds, 9 speeds, 10 speeds, 11 speeds, and of course those rides my Di2 battery died. I must say, though, that wanting an exception for a "velomobile" is a new one to me.

    1. Nothing can be done about group KOM vs solo. If someone is determined to take advantage of it, they will. I doubt that many people actually care. Get your own group together if you have to.
    2. Nothing should be done about any UCI legal bike (sans the weight requirement), TT or otherwise, used to set a record. If you don't like that someone used a TT bike, use one yourself.
    3. The bottom line is, if a segment is very competitive, then you need to be that competitive.
    4. Anything that isn't a "conventional bicycle" should not be part of the overall leaderboard, period.

    Give them a break. Rides are classified based on metadata in your activity. That metadata isn't under their control; it's essentially an honor system (see all the complaints about ebikes). To the extent possible, Strava is using algorithms to nudge people if an activity looks suspicious, but manually reviewing each activity would be cost prohibitive.

    I'd rather them spend their time on almost anything other than leaderboards for unicycles or velomobiles.

     

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  • Jason Lamoreaux - How would strava know if someone was riding in a group....pretty easy I would say. Strava receives FIT file data from GPS devices like Garmin. It records data at a user preset timeframe and within that are longitude/latitude data points at the start and end of that record together with the GPS timestamp. It wouldn't take much for Strava to check those values against other uploaded files on that day. Of course there would be some grey area i.e. You're part of a group then on a hill you get dropped but still get a PR and it may flag you as in a group rather than a solo effort (reason being it would be too demanding to check every record in a file so it would need to be an optimum sample set). Fair enough but those instances would be few and far between and the benefits, in my opinion, would far outweigh that. If you ride in a group you get flagged as a group ride even if you had one moment off the front. Ride solo and breaks PR's then it's bona fide. I rarely group ride but when I do I rather it was away from my favourite segments as I don't want my genuine solo PR's overwritten by a group effort.

    My 2p. I know a lot of friends share this opinion too.

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  • Jason Lamoreaux,Tony Poole
    Keep in mind that not everybody uses Strava. "Solo" would degenerated into "not in a group of Strava users".

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  • Tony Poole Actually, Strava is today able to detect that you are riding in group, it's already shown in your activity.

    But Strava is neither universal or Mandatory. I often ride with friends who are not on Strava. How Strava would detect that I'm riding in group?

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  • Alex Dimitriou - Strava is terrible at detecting whether someone is riding in a group.  Have you actually looked at what they claim?  I've been listed as riding in a group with people I never even saw on the ride, much less was ever close enough to for drafting or even communicating with them.  Their algorithm is terrible.  I am almost always riding alone, yet frequently am listed as riding "with" one or more others for some reason. Maybe I passed them somewhere along the ride and we rode a similar route for a distance?  Definitely not anything they could even begin to use to definitively determine group vs. solo rides.  You make a good point with the fact that not everyone uses Strava.  Even if they had a flawless method of evaluating rides uploaded to them as to whether they were in a group of other riders who also uploaded their rides, they would have no way to tell if you were riding with people who did not use Strava.  

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  • Strava can detect group efforts already:

    • You rode with a group, an algorithm already working
    • Matching segments in a ride at the same time, which also works in the flyby-function.

    Another (new) method like matching your statistics (HR, speed, wattage and wind/weather data) on a specific segment to other attempts could also be done, but it can be done much easier: just create a toggle.

    If Strava detects a group, the toggle is on and cannot be unset. In all other cases the user can set the toggle, that's all. It won't work 100% but it 'will do' and give users some form of control.

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  • Keith J. I'm sorry to hear about the trouble with the segments matched to your activity. This situation is typically caused by flexibility built into our segment matching algorithm that accounts for GPS drift in activities. However, this flexibility can also cause inaccurate segment matching in cases where two segments are located closely together. Please check out our help article for more information on this subject: https://support.strava.com/hc/en-us/articles/216918187-Segment-Matching-Issues. I hope this information helps clear up the confusion!

    Ben S. Thank you for your suggestion around including and excluding professional athletes from segment leaderboards. I am passing this feedback along to our Product Team for consideration in our future product roadmap.

    Merete Victor Thank you for your feedback regarding crew member classification for segments matched to rowing activities. Understanding how many crew were involved in a segment achievement could be neat information to compare. While we cannot promise immediate changes, I am passing your feedback along to our Product Team for consideration in our product roadmap.

    Enwezor Nzegwu You're in luck because the Strava mobile app does in fact allow you to view the 'Following' leaderboard when viewing a segment. To access the Following leaderboard, tap on the relevant segment and then scroll down to the Leaderboards section to locate the 'Following' leaderboard:

    Tony Poole We appreciate your feedback regarding segment efforts which occur as part of a group versus efforts which occur while solitary. I am passing this feedback along to our Product Team so that we can consider possible changes in the future.

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  • Strava can detect group efforts. But it doesnt separate group efforts from individual efforts on the leaderboards. Meaning riders in a group will get the koms leaving solo riders unable to get them.

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  • Wes Morgan I'm just saying if people can ride in group rides and get a kom or use a tt bike or other aero bike why cant i use my velomobile? Its essentially an aero bike. Its still under my own power not like im assisted. Also your whole if you dont like it then get one attitude is kinda my point. If you dont like that i can beat a segment on a velomobile then get one. And the whole weight thing strava asks for your bike weight already whether or not ur honest about it is a different story. But my point there was you can expect somebody on a 25lb bike to beat somebody on a climb using a 13lb bike for the same wattage unless of course the rider weight made them equal which strava also asks for and tracks as well as you height. So strava would know if somebody was below their height weight standards. This all depends on the honor system for the individual to put in the correct info. But as far as "conventional" bikes. Thats not a definition of what they consider conventional. Conventional is an opinion. If a rider has only used recumbents, thats a conventional bike to them, of a rider has only used velomobiles then a velomobile is a conventional bike to them, just like how you ride a diamond frame bike and that may be a conventional bike to you. But my point is strava discriminating against handicapped persons as well by excluding them from leaderboards with handicycles, recumbents and velomobiles. These bikes are adaptive meaning they can be configured to make somebody with physical disibilities more comfortable to ride. Which is also an ada issue when it comes to stores denying them entry into their stores ecause its a bicycle, but its not just a bicycle its a way for disabled people to ride again. Which honestly imo if its considered a bike by law that is 100% under your own individual power (unassisted) regardless of it's design it should be allowed on the leaderboards. I would like to see strava either relax the policy or make it more restrictive so that group riders, tt bikes, racers cant qualify for the segments or mileage either. But i dont think you uderstand what happens wen u put a ride in as a velomobile on strava. You know the monthly strava distance, climbing, etc cycling challenges they put out? Well a velomobile ride counts as 0 miles towards any of that. Heck even ebike rides count towards that. But a velomobile means nothing. To strava its not even a bike. Not to mention if you have a recumbent ive been riding my recumbent for the past year and had no idea recumbents were in a restricted category and it never mattered to anybody. Now that i have a velomobile which is just a faired recumbent trike now everybody wants to have an issue because its different and its faster than them. Well guess what i made segments and hold koms with my road bike that i still cant beat with my velomobile. And others still hold koms on routes that i cant beat with my velomobile or road bike. But i have been doing a lot of training over the past year all thru the winter as well to be faster and ride further in preparation for me to one day compete in the tabr and raam races. All the bikes i use can be used in those races.

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  • Can we add a feature to consider segments in reverse? I walk or run in my neighbourhood park, and both those activities have segments in different directions. If i go in the wrong direction, my segment is not recognised.

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  • Thank you very much Charles for letting me know about this! 👏

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  • Shivam, just make the opposite segment if you want it.

    Many segments won't make sense or will be dangerous in reverse.

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  • Shivam Shah - Segments are created by users just like you and me.  If you don't see one that you think there should be, then you should make it.  They are pretty easy to create using the desktop version of Strava.  Just open your activity, scroll to the bottom of the list of segments and click "Create a New Segment" and then follow the directions.  

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  • Shivam Shah Why not just create your own segments in reverse if that's the way you prefer to run ? I doubt any GPS will be able to calculate a segment in reverse !

     

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  • It would be a very good addition if we could filter the winter month from the summer. Since fatbike is a completely different sport, the downhill sections are most of the time faster than in summer and vice-versa for the climb. It creates some bizarre leaderboard were all the fastest time are in winter. The exact opposite is also true for the climbs...

     

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  • Samuel C. - I understand what you are saying, but it really wouldn't be possible to separate "winter" and "summer".  First, only some areas on the globe have different winter and summer conditions.  Second, half the work is opposite of the other half, so "winter" in one country would be "summer" in another.  Even in any one location, the months when snow is on the ground varies greatly.  I live in Alaska.  Some years, we are still riding on dirt into late December.  Other years, we have snow in the middle of October.  In the spring, sometimes we are still riding on snow in mid-late April, other years we are back on dirt in March. It also varies a lot depending on what part of the state we are in.  Some places are on snow a lot longer than other places.  It would be impossible to pick a set of dates when to switch from "winter" to "summer" to be able to break down the leaderboard accurately.

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  • Hey Quick Rick! Thank you for taking the time to put together such detailed feedback - I will definitely pass this along to our Product Team for consideration in regard to the overall fairness of our segment leaderboards. In the meantime, I'd like to kindly reiterate that recumbent bikes are allowed to be used with the Ride activity type. You can find this clarification in our community segment leaderboard guidelines: 

     

    Guidelines for motorized and non-traditional bicycles:

    The Ride activity type is for conventional human-powered bicycles (including recumbents) riding outdoors. Do not use this activity type if your activity includes data recorded while driving a car, motorcycle, pacing a vehicle, using an electric bike, or another electric-assisted vehicle, using a non-traditional bicycle with full-farings or aerodynamic modifications including velomobiles, or using a GPS simulator program for virtual riding. 

    https://support.strava.com/hc/en-us/articles/216919507-Segment-Leaderboard-Guidelines

     

    However, at this time, we ask that athletes who use velomobiles and handcycles continue to use the specified activity type. As mentioned, we appreciate the feedback on how these two activity types are reflected in your profile statistics and will pass this along for future improvements! Thanks!

     

    Hi Shivam Shah! As many of your fellow athletes have suggested, you can create segments that account for any part of your activity. Because segment data is based on GPS, you will need to create your reverse segment that reflects that specific, directional GPS data - it is not possible to just run or ride an existing segment in the opposite direction. If it helps, here is a resource describing the segment creation process: https://support.strava.com/hc/en-us/articles/216918157-Create-a-Segment. Thanks!

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