Segment Leaderboards

This is the post for all feedback and feature requests related to Segment Leaderboards.

 

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Commenti

328 commenti
  • Add a way to communicate with the creator of a segment.  It could be anonymous if you want to maintain their privacy (I don't think that is necessary).  There are far too many duplicate segments as well as poorly created segments (start too soon, end too late, using bad GPS data, etc...).  A lot of this can be fixed easily by the users if you allow others to communicate with the creator of the segment to suggest edits or point out that there already is an existing segment created.  

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  • Please consolidate regular bike and e-bike segments into a single segment datase but keep separated leaderboards depending on bike type. This would enable live segments for eBike riders, and remove the concerns about the lack of segments for eBikes, the unavailability of eBike segments search or not being included in the new route maker.

    It also enables riders to compare (but not compete) with people using different bikes, which I think is useful for DH segments.

    It also encourage eBikers not to record their activities as regular rides. How many of them do it just to get the same functionality as regular rides?

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  • E-BIKES ARE THE BIGGEST THREAT: As Susun Corda says above "leaderboards are one of the most differential features of Strava" and thus make Strava worth paying for the premium membership. Being primarily a mountain biker, I don't experience many problems with drafting or with people not completing the entire segment as described  by some users above. I see E-bikes as the primary threat to Strava as we know it. The leader boards have become polluted with e-bike times disguised as legitimate rides, and this makes the Strava Leaderboards meaningless.  It’s easy to spot the obvious effort when an e-biker takes a KOM on a popular steep climb, and then we can flag it, but what about all the e-bikers that are a bit slower and then go undetected? If this continues, and Strava continues to do nothing about detecting fake e-bike times, I will not renew my premium membership as Strava is losing its main attraction (to me).

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  • @Tom Reading  I don't want my rides to be deleted in 5 years. I'd like my KOM to still be there in 150 years if no one has beaten it. There are plenty of fellas already in my area with KOMs from 2013 who no longer ride as fast. If they are now 50 and can't push a big gear anymore I don't see why they should lose it if I can't beat their effort now. We need to do more to get rid of bad GPS efforts and people using e-bikes/cars on segments than deleting perfectly cromulent rides.

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  • Please bring back live segments with negative slopes. Half of my starred segments have disappeared as live segments even though I live in a very flat part of the world - if necessary you could tick off a box stating that you are aware of the risk of riding/running downhill.

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  • Can Strava make a separate category for MTB. It will allow me to see my real off-road effort (2 mile climb on dirt is not the same as 2 miles on road).

    It is important because MTB and road biking are totally different.

    An example of this is a trail that next to a road will mean my effort and segement times are compared with a road biker on a completely different surface and bicycle (my bike is 3 times heavier than most road bike bikes)

    I think this is a great idea because MTB and Road cycling are as different as snowboarding to skiing, ice skating to inline skating, SUP to surfing, walk to hike, canoe to kayak.

    Users of strava have wanted this for a long time. Thanks.

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  • Time to time I see ebikers ( confirmed ebikers with stats better than a pro tour cyclist) recording on normal riders segment. I first nicely ask them to record on proper category but some are really selfish and don't care and keep on doing it. and when confronted they block me to avoid being seen. I have created new accounts to be able to flag their rides and maybe they change their behavior. But after multiple flags, my flagging option is inactive. seems like strava allows me to flag one person only 6-7 times?!! while they ride 5 times a week. I don't like to stalk someone on strava but hard to avoid it when I see the ebiker on all segment leaderboards around our city and area.
    Just think of this: most cycling computers have training and recording tool. we use strava for it's comparison tool vs friends and local riders. With these ebikers if you don't let us to clean up the site from fake recordings there is no reason to use strava especially it's paid subscription service.
    This is an huge issue that we can not reach you to report a bad user. Yes! I can show the proof they use ebike and not wrongfully accusing someone. I know you can not police everyone but the least , please don't restrict us to flag ebikers.

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  • Currently KOM/CR is fastest of "all time". I would like to see the addition of KOM/CR for each calendar year.

    I know that currently you can refine the leaderboards you see by various things, including "this year", "today", etc., however what I am proposing is that at the end of each calendar year KOM/CR for that year would be handed out to keep.

    Many segments will at some stage in their life be hit by athletes who the vast majority of people will never match for pace. For those at the top end the challenge of trying to take that segment can be a real motivator and lots of fun, however for many they just have to write them off and look elsewhere. Over time an area can become saturated with nearly all segments becoming permanently out of reach to the vast majority.

    My proposal would see the fastest of all time remain, but would introduce the annual fastest, which would have the benefit of effectively reopening all segments to the whole community each year. I think this would drive engagement and inclusivity, and would love to see it adopted.

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  • I find it frustrating when people get the top of a leader-board only because they haven't completed the full length of a Segment.  In a recent example I saw a "KOM" performance by someone who had joined the Segment about 15% of the way after the start and left about 10% of the way before the finish.  Clearly the algorithm that matches athlete GPS data with Segment details has to have some tolerances in order to cope with minor GPS deviations.  However, as GPS accuracy seems to have generally improved in the last few years I wonder if the tolerances could be deceased slightly.  This would therefore require stricter matches to Segments and stop some of the these spurious KOMs.  Of course this needs to balanced with the risk that some genuine performances may be disqualified due to minor GPS drift - is this something the Strava experts have studied ?

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  • I’m with Peter. If something isn’t done to differentiate an Ebike from a non-electric powered bike, I’m dropping my premium membership. I’m not paying $60 year to see my KOMs taken by Ebike riders.

     

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  • I'm entirely confused about flagging. I've recently been flagging obvious shuttle car-riders who 1) specifically title their rides with the word shuttle and/or; 2) those which obviously are in cars with avg/ max speeds so high (like 14+ avg / 25-39 max) on 8-14% uphill gravel grades that even pros could not sustain at those lengths. Why am I then getting "temporarily disabled" flagging ability?  I'm then unable to flag these clear & obvious cheats for at least 24 hrs it appears. 

    Clearly Strava's "algorithm" doesn't work because several top 10 athletes w/ heart meters posting great times on the entire road (clearly earned) are then beaten mercilessly on uphill sections by 10-20 times the speed by obvious car riders. I realize Strava staff aren't reading this or seemingly concerned at all about the forum (which is confusing) - I've had several open tickets for almost a month now on obvious, simple issues they won't even reply to - so do any humans out there have any insight on this since Strava doesn't support their product too much? 

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  • Please develop an AI which automatically flags run activities with "wring activity type" when they are clearly rides (or drives when the athlete forgets to stop the recording). I wanted to flag activities at a segment, and after two dozens I'm nowhere near the end of it. I still see "runners" with 1minute per mile speed on the leaderboard. Only machines can deal with that many outliers.

    I'm a software engineer, so I can help with the ML heuristics for this if needed.

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  • As part of our continued commitment to improving segment leaderboard quality, we're excited to share that we've rolled out an additional advancement to our suite of invalid effort detection tools. This tool attempts to detect whether you accidentally uploaded an activity (ebike as ride OR ride as run) as the wrong sport type and places a simple and easy-to-use awareness banner on your activity page. With a few clicks, you can adjust the activity to the correct sport type. We look forward to continuing to improve on this tool and invest in ways to clean up historical bad data.
     
     

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  • Why not automatically ban from Strava a user who has his rides flaged more than X times.

    It could be a ban for few weeks 1st, and then a definitive ban if he has his rides again massively banned.

    It would help to reduce the noise of E-bikers declaring they are in normal MTB...  

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  • Why doesn't strava sanction people who open sabotage the system?

    In my region there is a single person who, for several months now, pollutes the segments with fake data produced by a script. As it seems, to annoy some users having the KOMs on that segments. He uploads the same identical fake data on up to 10 accounts to get not only the KOM but also the first 10 positions and giving the activities titles like "Script was faster than you".

    Strava was informed about that in endless Support requests from multiple users but always only deleted single activities - the fake accounts stay active, so that the next day the person uploads all data again.

    After several months of that behaviour, the leader boards here have gotten utterly useless.

    So when is strava starting to implement it's rules? Why should it be a problem to sanction users with complete expellation from strava?

    https://www.strava.com/activities/4316263360

    https://www.strava.com/segments/17780214?filter=overall

    https://www.strava.com/segments/17790914?filter=overall (This segment is part of the international road race Rund um den Finanzplatz Frankfurt at 1th May every year https://www.eschborn-frankfurt.de/de/home!)

    It seems to me strava allows the platform to become completely destroyed with their laxness.

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  • Andy Saiden - I totally agree with you that they need to create or at least fix their algorithm for automatically detecting unrealistic achievements.  That would take care of a vast majority of the problems.  They say they have something, but it is clear it either isn't there or doesn't work at all like they claim it does.  They could even have multiple levels of "flags", the obvious ones that just delete the activity from the leaderboards if it is far above anything realistic and then a lower level that just requires the user to verify that it was legit if it was just somewhat above the expected.  

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  • Segments with no rides in 18 months should be deleted. This would start to filter out segments made with bad GPS, and peoples old training routes.After that it would be nice to be able to nominate segments to be deleted or fixed [snaps to road.] 

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  • I would like that if you create a new segment on a course you could set a start date for that segment. Most Xco courses here in sweden are very compact and when theres a new design on the course all the old times are on the new segment. 

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  • I would love to see the addition of Top 10 results on a users profile, just as KOM/CR's are. This would increase engagement of the user base who are into these things. Sometimes a Top 10 time can be a huge achievement in its on right and would align to the publicly acknowledgement of such. Plus the data is all there currently so wouldn't be such a huge change. 

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  • Tom Tom Reading - I understand what you are saying, but I disagree with the idea of clearing people out just due to inactivity.  I think there are some options they could implement to address physical changes in the segment itself such as allowing the creator of a segment to set a "start date" for it, so if new features are added/removed, they could set a new segment that only takes into account attempts after that physical change.


    As far as removing efforts from people because they have been inactive for a period of time, I strongly oppose this.  If someone dies or has some kind of injury that prevents them from further activity in Strava, their achievements should not be discarded.  They still set that fast time and it should stand as the standard until someone can surpass it.  If I go break my back and can no longer ride, I would be really annoyed to see that my past efforts that were 100% legitimate and earned were just wiped from the record because I am no longer riding as if they never happened.  

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  • It would be nice, when filtering leaderboards, to have the option to see "that day" as a filter, rather than only "today". For example, it would be nice to look back on a group ride or event, and see who was fastest on the actual day of the activity.

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  • George M. - they had something like that a number of years ago.  It was resoundingly disliked across the board.  Rides early in the year were flooded with Q/KOMs for that year with other trophies mixed in for overall results.  It was just a mess.  I do agree that it would be fun to have the option to view the results for a particular year other than just the current year.  I would like to look back and see who had the fastest time on a particular segment in 2016 for example.  I don't think we need another set of Q/KOMs for that, but at least a leaderboard to view.  

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  • Similar to Alan (MTB and road biking), but with Nordic Skiing - classic vs. skate. I am a subscriber and love Strava for running, particularly the segments and leaderboards. It is great motivation! As much as I like Strava for running, though, the fun ends in winter as I mostly classic ski (Nordic) and there is no differentiation between skate and classic (as different as road biking and mountain biking). I have no opportunity to make a leaderboard as a classic skier competing against skate skiers. In effect, Strava does not yet include classic skiing. Suggestion: When starting a workout and choosing an activity from the already-listed Alpine Ski, Backcountry Ski and Roller Ski, break Nordic Ski into two options: Nordic Ski - Skate, and Nordic Ski - Classic. They could share the same segments but have different leaderboards. If not possible to share the same segments, then allow Classic to begin creating new segments for that discipline. Many have asked for this before - you would allow MANY Nordic skiers to gain full use of (and fun with) Strava in the winter! Thanks!

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  • ^ Totally agree that they should have an upper limit, whether it is world record pace or just an arbitrary speed, and flag anything that exceeds those limits. I was just looking at one of the cycling challenges where one of the leaders has claimed a ridiculous number of kms. Looking at his activities I see he is not only cycling at 50 kph for 4 hours, but he is “doing” seven activities in the same time frame ! One of them is walking  100 km in four hours ! Surely Strava can come up with an algorithm to not accept these ridiculous uploads ?

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  • Then please at least add the ability to flag an activity from the app instead of only being available on the website.

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  • Ah, the weekly "I want my wheeled contraption on the leaderboard" post. Let's create a leaderboard for unicycles, tricycles, hand cycles, recumbents, tandems, single speeds, 9 speeds, 10 speeds, 11 speeds, and of course those rides my Di2 battery died. I must say, though, that wanting an exception for a "velomobile" is a new one to me.

    1. Nothing can be done about group KOM vs solo. If someone is determined to take advantage of it, they will. I doubt that many people actually care. Get your own group together if you have to.
    2. Nothing should be done about any UCI legal bike (sans the weight requirement), TT or otherwise, used to set a record. If you don't like that someone used a TT bike, use one yourself.
    3. The bottom line is, if a segment is very competitive, then you need to be that competitive.
    4. Anything that isn't a "conventional bicycle" should not be part of the overall leaderboard, period.

    Give them a break. Rides are classified based on metadata in your activity. That metadata isn't under their control; it's essentially an honor system (see all the complaints about ebikes). To the extent possible, Strava is using algorithms to nudge people if an activity looks suspicious, but manually reviewing each activity would be cost prohibitive.

    I'd rather them spend their time on almost anything other than leaderboards for unicycles or velomobiles.

     

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  • I agree Jason, although I am not clear on how a solution would look. I think anonymity, or at least the option of it, would be important to some of the community. 

    Other examples of why I'd like this feature:

    1. Over the summer a couple of segments popped up near me on private land. I am pretty sure that this would have been an innocent mistake, but the segments appeared to be driving "running heat" to those spots. I am aware that you can flag up a segment for being dangerous or on private land, but I felt that some correspondence to say - saw your recent segments, please be aware that they're using private land and the alternative (public route) is here, blah blah blah.

    2. Renaming of segments. I enter a couple of annual trail relays and one of the things I use Strava segments for is learning the routes in advance. Over time the routes that the relays take has changed and so you end up with a number of segments all saying "Leg 3" and confusion as to which is the current one. I think a message to the creator saying "Please can you rename to this segment to Leg 3 (Old version)" would do the business.

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  • @Sylvain - If you guys are averaging 25-45 km/h, then you must be riding flat or downhill hardpacked roads.  Nobody, not even pro riders average those speeds on actual mountain bike trails.  Maybe you could hit toward the upper end on a good downhill section of a course, but that would be only select locations.  I could see someone averaging the lower end of that, maybe 25 km/h or up to around 30km/h during races on some courses, but in that range, e-bikes would be providing additional power (most assist up to about 32 km/h or so) which means by default, an equal rider on an e-bike will be faster than one on a standard mountain bike.  Trying to claim good riders are averaging up to 45 km/h on mountain bikes is just showing how little you actually know about what you are talking about.  Bottom line, if you put the same rider on an e-bike and then on a regular bike over the same segment/course, they will almost always put up a faster time on the e-bike except for a few unique courses such as downhill or highly technical courses where the weight of the bike makes a noticeable difference.  

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  • I have very much appreciated how leaderboards were organized and viewed on the Strava app before the recent update. No longer are the little charts that show where you place overall to the right of "All Time", "This Year", "Today", etc.  I would really love to see that come back because it makes it very simple to see how I did on any given segment very quickly and without doing math to tell what percentile I'm in.

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  • Regarding negative slope segments, those aren't available as Live Segments even to runners! I live in a moderately hilly area, which means half of all Strava segments aren't visible on my Garmin watch, which I use exclusively for running.

    What is especially silly is that any loop segment or an out-and-back segment ends up having 0% overall slope so it is available even if it is super hilly, so it all depends on a luck of whether the end point of segment is below the start point or not, regardless of amount of hills in between.

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